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+1 vote
What are some anti-civ books that explain why they believe the destruction of civilization would be better? The anti-civ stuff I've read will explain why industrialized civilization is a negative and should be destroyed, but stops there. So are there any anti-civ books that includes explanations of the negatives of civilization prior to industrialization? It's confusing if it's just limited to the negatives industrialized civilization.

To make it more confusing to me is sometimes the anti-civ people sound like they'd prefer to live in the conditions of the bourgeois prior to industrialization. For example, Bellamy's writings comes off that way to me. He suggests stuff like fishing, woodworking, herbal folk medicine... were common skills among the average person. But stuff like that was only really accessible to the elite classes prior to industrialization. A chair is something you'd think the plebs would've had in their home, but they did not. They usually had a bench and ate gruel. The average pleb usually didn't have the materials, means and know-how to make complicated stuff out of wood for themselves prior to industrialization.

I think that maybe due to many books that are about past societies tend to focus on the elite classes and so it's harder to get a sense of how average people lived in the past.

Did that Bellamy dude "cancel" himself or something?
by (4.7k points)
"stuff like fishing, woodworking, herbal folk medicine... were common skills among the average person. But stuff like that was only really accessible to the elite classes prior to industrialization"

is your question specifically about industrialization, not civilization per se? i'm not clear.

while industrial civilization is only a few hundred years old, civilizations are at least 10,000 years old. the statement i quoted above may be applicable when referring to industrial human civilization. but it would be absurd if referring to pre-civilized humans. are you referring to the period of civilization (less than 10K years ago) that is prior to industrialization?
Funkyanarchy, let's say between 500-1,000 years ago. I'm asking if there is an anti-civ book where it focuses on the everyday average peoples lives prior to industrialization in Eurasia and why it is a negative or problematic.  I assume there's an anti-civ book/writing that examines the structures of everyday life somewhere in Eurasia and at some point prior to industrialism. I've noticed indigenous people of some area are mentioned a lot.  If there is an examination of peoples prior to industrialization, it seems like the focus is mainly on the elites.

The woodworking and fishing thing was to attempt to indicate they're fairly recent and slowly became more accessible to the commoners instead just certain people.

@Nihilist, yes, the commoners didn't go fishing. I guess if they were part of a crew they did, but outside that not really. They had no easy way to get to a river or the ocean. Even if they did, the fish along the shoreline were depleted by the people of higher status than them, so were rivers. With the rivers it was dependent the location. The plebs in now what's France and Germany weren't allowed to fish in the rivers. They didn't have sailboats to go deeper out to sea to fish. Preserving and transporting the fish was problematic for the people that did. They could obtain fish from a merchants though. It was a tiny part of their diet. Most of their diet was from various grains and cereals, and occasionally salted beef. yumyum

The mechanical saw was mostly what made it possible and easier to do woodworking. It relies on sawmills. The plebs didn't have sawmills.

There are many things where you'd think the past pleb was doing this or that and had this or that. Like the fork, you'd probably think the fork has been around for a long time. It didn't appear until 17th century and didn't become widely used until the 18th century. People, especially priests, thought the fork was some sort of diabolical tool and bickered about it for like 80 years.

Is Ismael the one with the telepathic or talking gorilla?
"I'm asking if there is an anti-civ book where it focuses on the everyday average peoples lives prior to industrialization in Eurasia"

you might want to look at specific history books covering the time and place you are focused on. iow, not specifically anti-civ. you could then filter based on authors' perspectives/biases, if you can determine that.

1 Answer

+1 vote
against (his)story, against leviathan
by (52.9k points)
Thanks. I've read that, but it's not quite what I'm looking for.

Not really related, but it that book sets off my pet peeve.
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